Can Teams Governance and Business Performance Coexist?

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Hello, everybody, and welcome to this new episode of the Future of Information Management series. We have been starting for the past few months a new web series to really explore the future of information management, and today I'm very excited to have a guest like Benjamin Niaulin, ShareGate VP Product. And Benjamin has been spearing the spectacular growth of ShareGate in the Microsoft ecosystem. So we are very glad to have him. And Benjamin is also a long-time and well-known Microsoft MVP. So welcome, Benjamin.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Oh wow. What an introduction. Thank you very much, Yaacov. I'm very excited to be here. There's a ton to talk about, especially when we talk about governance and business performance. Definitely get very excited about this topic. Thanks for having me again.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Great, great. So maybe before we get into the agenda, you want to tell the audience more about yourself and ShareGate, and your role at ShareGate.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Yeah, I mean I started at the very, very beginning of ShareGate. So today I'm the VP of Product and make the decisions, and they're quite hard because we want to build for our customers. But essentially I stayed very close. I was originally in consulting from Microsoft 365 but before that, SharePoint on Premises. We still to this day stay very close to customers. We do a number of interviews every week, every month with our customers to find out what are the challenges around both moving to Microsoft 365, but also with the adoption. Ultimately you're not just migrating to Microsoft 365 to migrate; you want to adopt a better way of working. So we're trying to figure out what are the challenges our customers are having and try to tackle them. ShareGate historically has been very much known for migration, but we've expanded since into more of a management category.

So we're still investing in migration and still going strong there. But we also added provisioning, we also added lifecycle management, and as you can tell from everything that I'm mentioning, we're focused on the IT pros, or today in this day and age, it's anyone in charge of the productivity suite that's Microsoft 365. So it's not necessarily just the IT, but whoever essentially has those global permissions or SharePoint administrator permissions or Teams permissions to manage the environment. So yeah, in short, stay very close to customers and build the best product possible while trying to migrate.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Sure, we are all having a good time. Excellent. So this combination of technical skills and customer relationships, that's really what we are trying to offer in this web series, to provide best practices to our audience. So thank you. So I imagine that today will be really to dive into governance versus business and to look at the inner intention between the two and come up with some best practice how to manage governance in a Microsoft 365 environment, in a Microsoft Teams environment, and enhancing business performance rather than slowing down the business. And actually we will have a demo from Corey, which is our new product manager for the new harmon.ie, which is our next generation harmon.ie. So Corey will show us in a technical demo how to combine ShareGate and harmon.ie to get the best in governance and information management.

And also what's important for us is to have time to take your questions. So throughout the whole session, please use the chat window to ask questions and we will be very happy to look at your question and give pertinent answers.

The first time I really thought about looking at this tension be between business and IT is in our last event, in our last web event in the information management series, we had asked and we got answers from more than 50 IT and information management executives, what are the main challenges their organizations face when they are initiating a governance or compliance initiative? And the 62%, actually we don't see it here, but the 62% was engaging business users, those are issues like technology issue, but the blue line was really the one about engaging business here.

It's difficult to engage user in IM programs. It struck me that the main issue is not a technology issue, it's how to engage user. It's more a human issue, an adoption issue. And that's really what we want to talk about today. Our societies are becoming more and more paralyzed, a lot divided and people are fighting one against the other. And actually even within our businesses we see that everyone has his own prism, his own angle to look at the business, and it's becoming increasingly difficult to have people look at the bigger picture. So it has been used to police and to enforce governance and compliance and make sure the organization stays secure. And a lot of time this is being perceived by business units, which are today under tremendous pressure. Because of the economic conditions, they need to be more efficient, they need to deliver more results.

And on the other side, it has more and more pressure, more and more compliance regulation threats. And so that's really what we want to dive into and to really think together about what would be the best way to achieve a better management of extension and to really get business and IT back together. So that's what I want to ask you, Benjamin: how can we do that in the context of Microsoft Teams with Microsoft Teams also becoming the main business collaboration platforms that are video platforms where there is also this type of friction between the business side and the IT side?

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Absolutely. It's a really good question and we're seeing this very often. Like you said, it has a certain history in companies, so we're often seeing it as those that will block us or stop us from being able to use the tools that we think we need to use or the way we want to use them. Or sometimes they hide features or hide things from our products and what we use. So something seen as more of a negative thing. And I don't think it should be. I was talking to Microsoft's Ana Gamo and essentially she does a ton of stuff, but what she tries to get is better adoption of the platform and has talked about this in the past and what she called, I don't want to make everybody think that it's my word, but it really came directly from her and at Microsoft is what needs to be implemented or what needs to happen is something called frictionless governance. This is to figure out what you actually need from governance and how can you implement it in a way that it can be friction free or frictionless?

And that's where I think it becomes a different approach of not trying to police the environment, but really how do we serve business units while serving the company at the same time? So it's not two different priorities or two different objectives, it's really the same, and we have to figure out how do we optimize for that. So obviously for me when I'm talking a lot to it, so this is where we get all of these, the insights from and we really believe, or I really believe that the role of it is a bit different than it used to be and now needs to provide guardrails. So guardrails for me is putting the right things in place so that the tracks are there, but then people can use a car, a train, whatever they want to use, but they're on the company's tracks and that allows them to use whatever tool they need because everyone's got different behaviors and habits.

And what we're seeing is that if we just let people in Microsoft 365—so I got some stats for you to try and help you get a pretty good picture. Some of them are from even from ‘20 to 2021 because it was the dramatic change to the digital work. Everybody moved over to M 365, not necessarily by choice. We needed to continue working and we saw huge increases. As you know, there's thousands of customers that use ShareGate. This allows us to see certain things in terms of external sharing, in terms of lifecycle management. And I'll tell you about the impact that IT has and why people get frustrated with IT's choice of products and people are maybe upset. We are using SharePoint, we're using Teams. And what we're seeing is that for example, closest 74% external links per group growth from just September to February in 2021.

I can tell you that that number from my data is still growing. People are sharing externally more and more. So of course IT's immediate reaction would be we need to disable external sharing. It's scary, it could be a security breach, and we'll talk more about external sharing in a minute. We saw 66.4% increase in inactive groups over six months of inactivity. What that means is that people start creating work everywhere. They start creating spaces, workspaces everywhere, and all of a sudden the environment gets, I think I want to say polluted, it's not the right word, but you have so much content being created everywhere that if you're not applying the right information management or applying the right rules and guidelines and policies to automatically help people—and that's what I mean by frictionless governance, is helping people live in a productive environment. Because if you have an increase of inactive groups, you're starting to get an inefficient search, you're starting to get inefficient at navigation, you're starting to get inefficient at essentially the productivity that you are trying to get.

So as a business unit you're trying to be more efficient, and if it is not there to help you, it becomes a challenge. So there's a number of things really, and I've added a number of other stats here to help you really see, and we're seeing two major categories and that's lifecycle management and IT's external sharing. Now we're talking about lifecycle management and we're talking more specifically about Teams. What kind of guardrails can we apply, right? We're discussing this a little bit, and it's like, okay, Ben, you're talking about policies and high level stuff and we're seeing the environment grow, but what can people actually do? And that's where for me, guardrails starts at the very beginning when people create their workspaces or create their content. And at the IT level, what we can do to help put in those guardrails is provisioning, it's providing Teams template.

And when I say Teams template, I think sometimes people believe that I'm going to go straight to, oh, it's going to be an IT-based template just for rules that IT wants. And I don't think that's the way it should be. I think Teams template or any type of workspace provisioning should be focused on the intent of the users and through the research that we've been building here to build our own feature called provisioning. But through that research we saw time and time again that that's what comes up. If you build templates for your needs as IT's, it's doomed to fail because it's not what the business units are trying to accomplish. They're not trying to choose the right IT template, they're trying to get a project together, they're trying to get a community together, they're trying to build a document together. They have a specific intent of an outcome they're trying to reach.

So if you can build templates that match the desired outcome of the user guiding them, and that's where frictionless governance comes in, is if you're truly serving the end users, the business units to achieve their outcomes. And through those you apply the right rules and the right policies that you need as IT, you're ultimately going to be successful because they're going to find their desired outcome or something that facilitates their use case, but you'll also be able to safeguard them or put guardrails in place to make sure that they're safe while doing it and as efficient as possible.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So for example, I'm thinking about a supplier management template. Yes. If I have a big project with we or I, a relationship, pretty comprehensive relationship with a partner or supplier, or it could be a project management template or it could be a sales template. But that changed all of it because now IT needs to understand what the business needs, what not only it used to be, okay, we're the kings of technology, we know how to code and we know how to install and we know how to provision, but now we're talking about something else. So what type of training do we need to do for IT?

Benjamin (ShareGate):

It's a good question. Again, I mean IT is to be successful, IT is always changing because technology is always changing and it's going to be a lot faster continuously. I mean it's no surprise that eventually we'll talk about AI as well because it's always changing and you cannot just sit and assume that for the next 10 to 15 years you can continue doing the same role. So the role of IT is going to change. Absolutely. And needs to start serving the intent of customers while also understanding the best practices of the platform, which is difficult to maintain. No, I don't think there's an easy button to just press and all of a sudden you'll be the right kind of IT that you need. One thing, and I may be a little bit biased on this one, so take it or leave it, but I think that a productized approach to IT could be a good one.

And what do I mean by that? And the reason I say I'm biased is that we are a software company, so I see how we're working in terms of product and when we're building product, you have product managers. You're trying to figure out the customer challenges, the customer pains, and then you're trying to build a solution that's going to solve their customer pains but also achieve your desired objectives as a company and so on. And so I think that if you shift IT into more of a product mindset where you have customers, you have your end users or business units, they're your customers, how do you measure their success? How do you put the right metrics in place to measure that you are achieving what you want to achieve and then apply the right solutions, the right product value if you will, that delivers on that outcome for them, but you also get what you want, which could be blocking, external sharing, but at the right place at the right time.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

So this is really shifting from looking at end users to looking at them as customers. Yes. And that means it becomes like a software vendor or a solution provider. And I, it's funny you mentioning that. I was in Germany meeting with a large customer and we ended up there serving 185,000 user customers and actually it's 60 different business units. So what we're trying to do to help them with adoption of Microsoft 365 was to use some of our persona-based marketing. What is your persona? What's the pain of your persona? So I think that's really fascinating what you're saying, which is a need now to build IT department, IT specialists, IT companies, and they need the marketing team to do analysis of requirements to build persona. They need also to communicate, they need communication experts, marketing folks. It's a really big shift in the way we need to look, but I agree, I see some companies which are going there, but I think it's going slow for a lot of companies.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Yeah, we're hearing a lot of change and that's why sometimes, and I'm sure the audience has heard it too, it has been working, IT’s been different. It's IT and HR together, it's a new type of team, HR and communications, sorry, IT and communications team. So we're hearing it at some point. We called it the digital workplace team when the digital workplace was a theme around the world. So we're trying to figure it out. I don't think anyone has the answer. Depending on the size of company, your requirements will be different. IT budget isn't always the same either. So yes, we're definitely seeing a change in IT and we're all trying to figure out, but there is one common denominator: IT needs to change their focus from the technology to the customers, which is the business units. There is that change that is happening and then you need to deliver to customers. And that's where all these ideas are coming. The digital team, a communications team, it's delivered to customers.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Okay, excellent. So Benjamin, you mentioned AI and we are seeing a lot of buzz on AI. We at harmon.ie as information management leaders are looking at how AI can help you classify content, to know also which content should be saved and preserved versus which content should be just transient. I think we have so much content that we need some help to some guidance and maybe a machine could do it better. So what's your take about things like Syntex and the metadata? What's your take on that part of the equation?

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Oh, that's a good, good, good, good question. So AI at the core is one of many solutions, and I think it will help immensely because the technology of AI itself is something that we should consider as a tool to help us achieve outcomes that are hard to do ourselves. In terms of Syntex, I think there's good value there, right? Because we know the challenge of metadata, metadata is key, metadata is core and it just means additional information, right? Historically we collected what we know in SharePoint columns and we do it manually. There's other ways to collect metadata. Now, Syntex, I think is in its beginning. I like the idea, I like the concept. I think it is still, it's not for everyone in the sense that you need to learn it, you need to apply it. I think it's maybe an opportunity for larger organizations, but it comes with its own challenges. Nonetheless, though, the idea, if we think again about the desired outcome, which is information management, I think the idea of extracting metadata and helping users get their work done more efficiently, the idea of it is definitely something interesting.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Okay, excellent. So if I summarize a little bit, we talked about the new role of IT, which really needs to look at the user as customers and try to really understand the requirements, partner with HR, with marketing to communicate more efficiency to these groups and having not only the technology side, but also the human side of the equation. So that's one thing we talk about. And I really like this idea of provisioning and providing templates in Teams for example. So you can provide a portfolio of templates which will fit the business and all the security guards and all maybe the metadata required are basically a function of these business requirements.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Yeah, exactly. So I wanted to dig down a little bit further into that. When you provide these templates, we touched on making sure you deliver on the outcome or the intent. What are people thinking when they're clicking? Oh, I need a new workspace. And when they see your little popup that shows the different templates, do they see their intent displayed there for them? But then it's up to you as IT to make sure that depending on their intent and who they are and any other additional information, you can apply the right rules that you need. So when we're talking about what are the best practices, typically we say make sure that there's some kind of a time component. How long, depending on what type of template you're creating, how long do you want it to live there? Until you start asking the owner or the creator, should we archive it?

Should we delete it because it was supposed to be a community, so maybe it stays. Or if it's a document, do we delete this workspace? You've got the document now. So we definitely need to apply those rules. I always recommend having at least two owners, at least two owners per workspace that you create because owners have certain rights that members do not have. So if the owner’s no longer there, do you have the right rules in place? And then everything that touches on security, sensitivity, labels, external sharing and guest. And I wanted to touch on a little story. Two years ago about, or right before the pandemic, we worked with a company called Funko. We did a video with Microsoft as well. It's available online. If you just look for Funko and Benjamin and Microsoft, you'll find the video series. And essentially they're a toy company, they make toys, their office is hiding behind the toy store inside.

It's amazing. And they have slides inside. It's obviously a great culture and a great company, great product. And you would assume that, oh, because it's a company that works with these toys, no rules, no policies, it's just everyone creating everything. Well, on the contrary, it's probably one where I saw the most policies and rules because they work with Disney. So if you work with Disney and you're going to work on the next Star Wars movie to make the toys, you don't want the next Star Wars action figure to be leaked online and know who the characters are going to be because the movie hasn't come out yet. And so it's very crucial that even though it's not about company culture, it's not about whether we're fun or we're not fun, policies and applying the right guidelines to help people work is across every type of company and use case and business case.

So through provisioning and through these policies, they're able to say, oh, you're working on a special project with Disney. Well, then automatically external sharing is disabled, auditing is enabled, tracking, and so on. So you apply what keeps your company safe, but you deliver on the business outcome and intent of the user that creates the workspace. And I thought this example was super important to mention because I had a moment where I said, oh, it doesn't matter whether you have a slide in the company or you have a secret entrance or, I think they had a bowling alley as well inside. It doesn't matter. At the end of the day, you have business performance and business intent and the business security which forces you well, not forces you, but makes you want to enable these guardrails that allows people to work efficiently.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

That's a great example of combining these business requirements with IT governance and really having IT to understand and provide the guardrails for the business to achieve its goal. So thank you. I think that's some great example. A lot of good takeaways. Now I'm very glad I invited you. This is really a good session.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Good.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

What I wanted to do, I think we wanted to do a poll, Maya, about the use of AI. And we're looking right now at a lot of research going on at harmon.ie, and I think you were saying also how to use AI to deliver better information management. So here the question is: how could AI help you manage your organizational information management? And we have a couple of options and these are features we are looking at providing, but one by recommending what items to save, where to save this item, what metadata filled for a specific item. Or maybe you have another idea. If you have another idea, please put it in the chat while looking for good ideas. So that would be phenomenal. And if you really think AI can't help, don't be shy to say it, although this is not fancy, but some people think it's a lot of fuzz, a lot of buzz, but you won't help us. But I see your people are believer, so we're still collecting responses. Don't be shy. Help us get some data. If you have good ideas, we are looking for good ideas. We know we have customers which are geniuses and we want them to contribute.

Maya (harmon.ie):

Okay, let's see the results.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Okay, so we have 89%. So we have a lot of folks which voted and we have 89% which would like AI to help them recommend metadata fields for a specific item like an email to save in SharePoint or in Teams. And to be able to apply metadata by machine learning, machine learning would actually say, well that makes sense. Metadata is really key and really core, very visible and attached with metadata. So absolutely, that's a great example. And also interesting. Yeah, I think we've seen this.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Go ahead. Go ahead.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

No, no. Also interest, it's what to save. I don't necessarily know what I need to save and this may be a design which going to help and it needs to be retained. I was looking at RFP, of a big public sector in Canada actually, and they were saying they're looking at some documents which need to be saved be for 25 to 100 years. I don't know which document, I don't have any document that you need to keep for 100 years.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Well, apparently they do.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Maybe it's Shakespeare or something like that. Maybe you are writing things like that, Benjamin, I don't know.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

No.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Okay, this is really good. This is super interesting. We're going to take that into account in our roadmap. We have an upcoming AI hackathon happening at harmon.ie on August 2nd. So we are doing a little bit of a competition using OpenAI and that's going to be interesting. So excellent. So what we want to do now is actually to drill down to another level and have a demo, and that's why I invited Corey to really take us for a demo and see how we can combine and how we can implement this approach of frictionless governance and frictionless information management.

Corey (harmon.ie):

Thanks, Yaacov. We can just go over to the next slide. We'll talk a little bit about how, with everything we've talked about today, how we can actually bring that into practice with different tools. In this case we'll talk about ShareGate and creating that frictionless governance experience, setting templates for Teams, setting those guardrails so that end users can sort of play within those guardrails and set up Teams and then interact with content with harmon.ie, then empowering end users to save and share and organize content within the teams that you've organized and set up through ShareGate.

There's three parts to this demo. We go over to the next slide. The first part is we'll show how you'd set up a Team template on ShareGate. So this is more of an admin task and then we'll talk about how a business unit can create a team from that template that it had just set up. And then we'll talk about how end users can save, share, and organize content in and out of those teams, how they can add metadata at the time of saving and how they can easily know, use the content that's been set up and engage with it. So I'll share my screen here.

Can you see my screen?

Yael (harmon.ie):

Yep.

Corey (harmon.ie):

Great. So here we are on the ShareGate admin portal in the provisioning tab here. And we can very easily set up a Teams template that business units and end users can then use to create teams. So you have a few options when you're setting up a Teams template through ShareGate. First off, you'll name the template. We'll just give it a moment to load.

Benjamin (ShareGate):

It's always during demos that—

Corey (harmon.ie):

Yeah, exactly. You'll name the template and then you'll set up the rules of the template. So as Benjamin said, he recommends at least two owners of a team. You can set up the six here, name and [unintelligible] if you want a prefix specific to the name or a suffix here, whether or not the team needs to be approved by IT once it's created. And then the policies for the team. So is it public or private? When you use this template, is there a certain sensitivity level? Can it be shared? Can you have guests? And the purpose tags are here, we've tagged it as department. And then what's really great is you can actually use an active SharePoint site as a blueprint for how the team is set up. So we're using a SharePoint site here that has specific views already set up, specific metadata required, so that's linked to the team. So when we create a team with this template, all of that will be translated over and modeled after that SharePoint site.

And then you can also define specific channels. Here we have a channel for work that's in progress and that'll be added to the Teams template. So once this template is created in the ShareGate web portal, you can then go right into Teams. And this is where business units can go into the ShareGate tab here and very easily now create new teams based on that template that we just created. So you can create a new team with this button here. You choose the template, all the templates would show up here, get some details about the template and then use this template. You can see the prefixes here, the suffix would be there as well. You can name it, add a description, add another owner. And then when you go to your teams, here we have the team created. You can see the channel was automatically created.

And within the files tab, we have here the specific metadata views and columns that were in that SharePoint site. So here's the regular view, but we can go into our detailed view. This came from the SharePoint site where we now have specific fields like status, owner, due dates. These were required fields and this came from the SharePoint site and it's required now for any content saved to this team.

So the third part of this, now that you have your team created, you want your users to engage with the team, share content in and out of the team. And that's where harmon.ie really comes in. So we're in Outlook. So harmon.ie is here. We really bridge the gap between Outlook and Microsoft 365. So you can see all of your locations within SharePoint, Teams, and OneDrive. Recent items you've used, if we open up the team section, we can see here's the team that we created. There you can see the channels as well. And very easily—let's say I got this sales document that we want to drag into the team, we can drag it in just like that from email. We know that email is still really the main inflow and outflow of information, and since we have that required metadata, we can easily add that at the time of saving right through harmon.ie. So we can add Yael as an owner here.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Can you show us the AI where [unintelligible] get that I need to be the owner or not quite yet?

Corey (harmon.ie):

That's coming soon.

We can add the due date here. We can add a retention label and you save that. That was the required, whatever fields were required, they'll pop up at the time of saving. So you can easily drag items in to anywhere across Microsoft 365. And then that also goes to the flip side if you want to create a new email. There's not really an easy way naturally to get your content into an email from Microsoft 365, but harmon.ie makes it very easy. You can jump into that team that we just were at here. We can also see the views. So if you have a lot of content, you can see the same views that we had and we can filter by metadata and then we can easily drag in either as a link or directly as an attachment. It's really the easiest way to share content from Teams and from SharePoint, from OneDrive into any email.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

So that really shows us how we're making it easy for IT to define the right metadata that should feed the business. And then harmon.ie is making it easy for end user to effortlessly add metadata and apply metadata from their comfort zone from an email with a lot of important documents or an entire email they want to save. And basically we're automating or semi automating, make it easy to apply metadata. And I think that's the next steps to really get to more automation by suggesting metadata fields.

Corey (harmon.ie):

Even before AI, we are doing a number of things to automate metadata and just automatically extracting metadata. So one example is an email review that we automatically create. So if you have this feature enabled on harmon.ie, we know a lot of teams, if you're, if you're a sales team or you're dealing with third parties, you might be saving important emails. Maybe I don't just want to save this contract, but I want to save the whole email. So we actually will automatically create an email view in that team. So if the user drags an email in, they'll be prompted. Now would you like to create an email view? You can choose to create the view and then within Teams you'll automatically see that view now created. So what that means is all the metadata, if we look here where I've done it already, all the metadata from the email will show up in an automatically created email view. We can go to this email view here, we'll see the subject of the email, who it's from and to, who is CC'd, if we have an attachment in Teams. And this is done automatically. So the user doesn't actually have to input any metadata.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

So for example, in this supplier template that we talk about, you are you working with a supplier or you have a large project management with multiple companies involved, there are some key emails about commitment that every party is making. Of course you have contracts, but you have also during the operational phase, you have a lot of key emails and you are able to save them in the right teams.

Corey (harmon.ie):

Exactly.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Excellent. So maybe we'll take some questions. We have seen, we have got the big picture from Benjamin. We have seen how we implemented ShareGate and harmon.ie. Thank you, Corey. Now maybe it's time for questions.

Maya (harmon.ie):

Okay, so we have a couple of questions. Yeah, couple questions for you. We are using folders rather than metadata. Does harmon.ie support the folder structure to classify documents?

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Okay, so a lot of people they say, “We want to stay with folders, that's what end user are used to.” Maybe Corey, you want to show how harmon.ie supports folders to do drag and drop. So we actually, we have a preview which enables you to drag and drop to any, even if you have a deep hierarchy of folders. But I will let Corey show it.

Corey (harmon.ie):

So I'll add a team here that I know has a lot of folders. So sometimes you want to use folders, and with harmon.ie, you can see in a simple tribute all of the locations and the sub locations. So if I wanted to save this email, you can drag and open up all the, you'll see all the channels first and then you'll see the level below that, which is all the folders. And if there's sub below that, you can even continue drilling down as much as you want. You'll see all of the locations. So it's very easy to get a view of everything in one place here and to drag either from Outlook or between folders, the right content to the right place.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Excellent.

Maya (harmon.ie):

Thank you, Corey. Benjamin, this is a question for you. In our organization, IT is playing a role of policing the business rather than enabling the business. Is there a best practice of how to train IT to be more of a business enabler?

Benjamin (ShareGate):

Ooh, tell them to come see me. No, no, no. Honestly for IT, it needs to come from the top typically because otherwise it won't change. So training is one thing, but the best is really to try and bring the right behaviors in place. But you need executive so that it trickles down. So IT needs a type of leader that's able to make the changes because otherwise they'll just continue to go on. But what's good is that right now there is this shift a little bit where because of the current economic context, the business objectives are quite on top of everybody's mind. And so it's a good opportunity at the same time to try and see how to propose a business case or show how changing certain behaviors could help increase the attainment of objectives. So if you're looking for executive buy-in so that it trickles down to IT but ITis not putting it in place right now, you need to go and somehow speak the business language. So what is the objective that you could look to impact? How does this change what would come as an outcome to you as a business unit so that the change could happen? Otherwise it's hard to get IT to change if it's not coming from them.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Executive buy-in is key. Absolutely. Good.

Maya (harmon.ie):

Thank you. And we have time for one last question. Is there a combined package of harmon.ie and ShareGate?

Benjamin (ShareGate):

There isn't at the moment, but you can always talk to us both and we'll figure something out.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Excellent. Anything else, Maya?

Maya (harmon.ie):

No, I think we covered most of the questions.

Yaacov (harmon.ie):

Okay. So I want to thank Benjamin for joining us for this. Great. Thank you very much. And also Corey for putting together this really super demo where we have seen frictionless governance. Couple that with easy to fill metadata and basically that's also the same frictionless information management. So thank you very much. And we will see you, I think in August we're probably going to skip, everybody's on the beach, but in September after Labor Day, we’ll be back for another episode of the Future of Information Management. Thank you. Amazing. Thank you very much. Take care. Bye-bye.